Ari (creature of dust, child of God) (![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
wisdomeagle) wrote2003-12-20 10:56 am
wisdomeagle) wrote2003-12-20 10:56 am
(no subject)
Thoughts on slash and just what it is about two boys shagging:
See, for me, the question of why straight girls like slash is, at least on the surface, pretty straightfoward. Boys. Shagging. Boys pretty, two boys even prettier. So much for straight girls.
But why do I like slash? Moreover, why have references to queerness in mainstream novels always made my heart go pitta-pat in a way that nothing else really has? So much so that in one novel I read on page 598 or something, there's a reference to some random relative who lived in San Fransisco with an Airman and this struck me so deeply that, depsite the fact that it was irrelevent to the plot, I remembered it for years? Of course, I spent many years trying to figure out if I actually was looking at homoerotic subtext or if it was just my brain being dirty. Then, I reread and realized, yeah, they're clearly canonically gay. And then I found slash and realized it was a moot point. But the fact remains: Boys in love make me go squee like few other things, including female queerness. Sure, I read lesbian fluff, have several very bad lesbian novels on my bookshelf at home... but it doesn't hurt the way boys realizing they like other boys does.
And I realize that it's not really so much about being a fag-hag or a girlfag. Oh, I like the gaybois I know in real life, but it's not the same dynamic. It's all about the fictional gaybois, the literary gaybois, the Beautiful Slash Objects.
And it's not like I'm all about reading pulp written by actual gaymen. That's written for a different audiance, with different kinks, and they aren't mine. I mean, h/c is not a big thing in gay porn. Nor is UST, from my understanding.
So, for all we're stressing realism, for all I scream "canon!" really, I love playing in a fictional universe, and yeah, I feminize my gaybois, because I write the world and I write the Stargate universe from my perspective, and my perspective is decidedly feminine.
But explain to me this: gay male porn is about very masculine guys, very muscled, very... macho. And straight men's lesbian porn has very feminine women, high heels and lipstick and all. While in lesbian porn and in slashfic, the characters are somewhat androgynous. Is this a fundamental difference between boys and girls and what turns us on? Is it a function of the social construction of gender?
Am especially curious to hear from the gaybois on my list who read both slash and gay porn written by gay men.
See, for me, the question of why straight girls like slash is, at least on the surface, pretty straightfoward. Boys. Shagging. Boys pretty, two boys even prettier. So much for straight girls.
But why do I like slash? Moreover, why have references to queerness in mainstream novels always made my heart go pitta-pat in a way that nothing else really has? So much so that in one novel I read on page 598 or something, there's a reference to some random relative who lived in San Fransisco with an Airman and this struck me so deeply that, depsite the fact that it was irrelevent to the plot, I remembered it for years? Of course, I spent many years trying to figure out if I actually was looking at homoerotic subtext or if it was just my brain being dirty. Then, I reread and realized, yeah, they're clearly canonically gay. And then I found slash and realized it was a moot point. But the fact remains: Boys in love make me go squee like few other things, including female queerness. Sure, I read lesbian fluff, have several very bad lesbian novels on my bookshelf at home... but it doesn't hurt the way boys realizing they like other boys does.
And I realize that it's not really so much about being a fag-hag or a girlfag. Oh, I like the gaybois I know in real life, but it's not the same dynamic. It's all about the fictional gaybois, the literary gaybois, the Beautiful Slash Objects.
And it's not like I'm all about reading pulp written by actual gaymen. That's written for a different audiance, with different kinks, and they aren't mine. I mean, h/c is not a big thing in gay porn. Nor is UST, from my understanding.
So, for all we're stressing realism, for all I scream "canon!" really, I love playing in a fictional universe, and yeah, I feminize my gaybois, because I write the world and I write the Stargate universe from my perspective, and my perspective is decidedly feminine.
But explain to me this: gay male porn is about very masculine guys, very muscled, very... macho. And straight men's lesbian porn has very feminine women, high heels and lipstick and all. While in lesbian porn and in slashfic, the characters are somewhat androgynous. Is this a fundamental difference between boys and girls and what turns us on? Is it a function of the social construction of gender?
Am especially curious to hear from the gaybois on my list who read both slash and gay porn written by gay men.
no subject
I've always been a bit bothered by the very black/white view of lesbians; there's the dyke, and then there's the femme. I dunno; that always seemed kinda stereotyped to me.
And unlike some books I've read, they don't seem to be represented as coupled off dyke/femme. They seem to be either femme/femme or dyke/dyke. I'm not sure if this is a genuine reflection of society or just the bigoted media's portrayal of what they assume lesbians may be. Maybe it's not important.
I've come to feel, basically, who cares? We all like what we like, and hopefully it'll like us back. I say this to let you know ahead of time, I've got no real helpful answers; just some curious observations.
To really understand the various porn media, they must be viewed independantly of each other.
Hetero male-aimed lesbian porn is meant to play up the hetero male ideal of a woman; that is, the opposite of a man. Hence the playboy bunny-type actresses.
As for gay male sex, I imagine they want the opposite of what the hetero male wants; someone who opitimizes the ultimate male. Hence the man meat in the male porns you refered to.
As for lesbian type slash, I dunno; maybe the concept is, with a majorally androgenous audience (I'm assuming, I dunno) the readers want to experience stories in which they can picture a person like themselves? I dunno; I'm just guessing here.
As for the appeal of gay male porn, I dunno, but it's definately there. I think it's cute, but that's just me.
Maybe the extra excitment is due to societies advanced acceptment of lesbians as opposed to gay men. It's kind of ok to be a lesbian, or for girls to like each other; hell, even straight girls are allowed, nay, encouraged to have affectionate feelings for one another. Just look at t.a.T.u.
Girls are pretty creatures. They look cute and smell nice. They'll compliment each others hair, clothes, whatever, and sometimes form attractions for one another, all in a non-romantic environment.
For two males to like each other is much more taboo. Guys do not normally admire each other's appearance or other romantic qualities. For one guy to have feelings of attraction towards another guy is a much more significant emotion; it means that, whatever it is, something legitimate it there. Maybe they're bi, maybe they're gay, or maybe it's just a curiousity, whatever, but in any event it's a bigger deal with guys.
In addition to the more forbidden nature of boy/boy love, another appeal of it, in fact, may be the very fact that you're a lesbian. Being a girl who is attracted to other girls, the concept of boy/boy love is more foreign to your sexual mentality (not stranger-like, since you're hardly cloistered from gaybois, but it's still not your native language, so to speak). The unfamiliar translates into the exotic, and it's almost intrigueing.
I dunno. I'd just guessing here. But there's certainly something cute about gayboi love. More genuine. Who knows.
(no subject)
no subject
I love jack/daniel fics so much, cause it brings two people that I love from an amazing showing and brings them together in love. It just gives me a warm fuzzy feeling inside that makes me smile, and of course I yearn for a similar love.
(no subject)
no subject
While my own gaybois make me happy and giggle what they're all lovey=dovey with each other, you're right, it doen't give me the same Oh. My. Golly. Gosh. *pitta patta* that a nicely written, or sometimes even pathetically written, J/D will. Even my mum goes all giggly when there is a distincly slashy moment on the telly.
I like boys shagging because I like boys so why shouldn't boys (which is what I tell all the flamers I get) I love boys. *girlygiggle* I couldn't eat a whole one...but I bet Daniel could...
Not very intellectual but its early and far to close to Christmas for my brain to have any intellectual brainwaves zinging around. I'll think about it and get back to you.